Here’s another one which blows the cuff off my arm:
During a town hall on the Fox News Channel on Tuesday, U.S. Senate candidate Rep. Tim Ryan (D-OH) argued that “we don’t want to do fracking on federal lands.”
In the first place, I’m guessing that by “we” he means “we asshole Democrats who are in thrall to the Greens”. But that’s not what gets me going, because one expects that kind of bullshit from a candidate, especially one of the DemSocs.
Am I the only one who thinks that the only lands that belong in federal hands are military bases, fedgov offices and national parks? Or is the Gummint the landowner in only those circumstances today? (I know what the Constitution provides, but have they overstepped this one, as they have so many others? The map seems to support the latter supposition.)
If I’m wrong about this, then feel free to let me know in Comments, with supporting arguments.
Kim;
Get out your pocket Constitution, ’cause I’m a gonna axe you a question. Can you point to a single provision therein that authorizes national parks? Not that I object to them, but where is it written? Or is this possibly the “Progressives'” camel’s-nose?
At least one National Park ( Acadia in Maine ) was created when a group wealthy New England Landowners bought up all the remaining land that they didn’t already own, created a Trust and donated the trust to the People through the Government. John Mier and the Serria Club ( with Teddy Roosevelts help) were responsible for the first parks in the west.
As for authority to do so, It’s a little late to be asking that question.
It was the camels nose.
The Constitution allows for the federal government to have post offices and post roads (so I give the interstate highway system a conditional pass), 10 miles square for DC, and all places purchased by the consent of the legislature of the state in which the same shall be, for the erection of forts, magazines, arsenals, dockyards, and other needful buildings (Article I section 8).
In that Article X, The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people. Since there is no provision for federal public lands other than as mentioned, these lands are in violation of Article X as well.
The public lands of the west were extorted, in that the states were forced to give up the land to the federal government in order to become a state.
If one drives through the forests in the west, where public and private ownership varies by section, you will see well maintained forest (almost German in it’s order) and a wildfire waiting to happen. Because people’s jobs depend on it – both ways
Well, a lot of the land in the west (thoose vast red areas ) is federal land by default. Most of Utah, Navada and parts of Arizona is High Desert and not exactly hospitable and the rest is still radioactive. . Those big squares in SD ND and MT are Indian Reservations and “disputed Federal Land”.
And they are also doing their best to stop fracking on privately owned land as well.
But yes, the proper term should be “Public Land” as in the Taxpayers own it. But the Pols think they own it.
You sir are 100% right.
60% of my state is owned by the fedgov. And it’s a GD travesty.
60% …. Hold my beer!
NV is 80.1% Federal Land (Yea, we’re #1).
I knew that, I’m familiar with the plight of my neighbors
Statistic is correct but the devil is in the details. There is a giant military complex N. of Vegas. Nellis AFB, Area 51, Nevada Test Site plus a smaller one around Fallon. For some reason, they count Indian reservations as Federal land. The Indians have an issue about this. Big rez at Pyramid Lake plus other smaller ones. Then there is the Lake Mead Recreation Area which is huge. Several large National Wildlife Refuges which assorted hunting organizations support. Mostly bird hunters but there is a large antelope refuge up in the NW.
One of the many reasons Canada does worse than the USA is “Crown Land”.
How much Crown Land is there in Canada?
Less than 11% of Canada’s land is in private hands; 41% is federal crown land and 48% is provincial crown land.
When I depose that useless fool King Charles, I’m going to sell it all.
You aren’t wrong. You just understate the problem.
As a percentage Nevada sure is the winner. In total land, well my state, Alaska, has over 1/3 of all
Federally owned land. But it’s the restrictions that drive us nuts. Roadless Rule!?? We couldn’t put in 10 miles of road in order to reach a village that becomes isolated in South Central AK.
We finally get the ability to drill, and FJB jots a note and it’s no longer allowed.
We wanted to build a power inter-tie, we can do it but it needed to be along the most restrictive and expense route possible. We could of built two dams for the cost of that damn inter-tie.
This idea of Federal Land is just so ‘clotting’ wrong. Given the crap we put up with, I think it is only fair that we declare the Mississippi and it tributaries, “Wild and Scenic” rivers, and then ban all traffic on the rivers, and stop all dumping and of any kind into them.
Most of the literature is about the National Parks. Try “Playing God in Yellowstone”. Another classic is the stuff about predator elimination on the N Rim of the Grand Canyon leading to a deer explosion and the destruction of the forest. There is undoubtedly more modern stuff. Most of my observations are based on 50+ years of using the public lands and I have never written a book about it.
Secession from the USA, and annexation by Texas, until Texas stretches to Canada and the Pacific.
How about Texas takes Western Canada too so there’s a nice all Texas route from Texas to Alaska.
And I thought it was going to be the “we don’t “do” fracking that was gonna set you off.
Fracking is plural, and the “do” in front of it is just another corruption of language.
We may not be able to “do” driving soon either.
The National Park Service is the most abusive of all Federal land agencies. The Forest Service and BLM are benign by comparison. NPS had to be forced by Congress to allow self-defense when the FS and BLM had always followed state law. There is a long trail of litigation regarding the NPS attempts to prohibit the Utes from selling trinkets and snacks on their own land adjacent to Mesa Verde because the NPS illegally built a road on the rez. They use Federal employees to control out of control deer and bison populations rather than let hunters in. They are the pioneers in wolf reintroduction and the wolves have spread all over the West and also the pioneers in the law enforcement method of managing conflicts rather than the economic method. They are bat guano crazy about anything regarding bears. Park Service lands include what amount to regional parks near NYC, San Francisco and Cleveland. They have completely mismanaged fire policy. There are airports, luxury hotels, commercial developments, LEO only shooting ranges, and ski areas in National parks.
So no, don’t exclude the National Parks from your rant. As a counterpoint, consider TX. I know you live there but you don’t seem to spend much time outdoors. When TX joined the US, they came in by treaty which provided that the public lands would be owned by the state, not the Feds. In the late 1800s, the politicians bankrupted the state and got out of their jam by selling off the land. Fast forward to today and there is very little access to outdoor recreation unless you pay a landowner. There is Big Bend which was donated by the state and wealthy private parties and is subject to all the NPS abuses. Guadalupe Mts. NP was a LBJ boondoggle and also under NPS rules. There are some NF lands in the east that were rebought by the Feds as a relief measure during the Depression. And there are the state parks which are large in number but small in area. The only big one is Big Bend Ranch State Park which was a private goat ranch for several hundred years so you can imagine what kind of shape it is in. There is a reason why Trump wasn’t supportive of Sagebrush Rebellion 2.0.
FS and BLM need some fixing to eliminate their high-handed actions. The NPS should simply be abolished and the National Parks administered by the FS or BLM depending on where they came from.
could you recommend any sources, sites, books to read up on how the Federales mismanage our public land?
Thank you
JQ
Most of the literature is about the National Parks. Try “Playing God in Yellowstone”. Another classic is the stuff about predator elimination on the N Rim of the Grand Canyon leading to a deer explosion and the destruction of the forest. There is undoubtedly more modern stuff. Most of my observations are based on 50+ years of using the public lands and I have never written a book about it.
as far as energy goes, I retort to the watermelons, Drill baby drill!!!
There is plenty of land where we can cut timber, mine and drill for natural ore etc and restore the land back to how it was before we used these natural resources to promote our national prosperity.
JQ
So, if it’s too late to be challenging the constitutionality of a crime that was committed before my grandparents were born, I should STFU? I. Don’t. Think. So.
All of this was the result of the federal government grabbing all unclaimed land in the early 20th Century, and then closing it to homesteading.
The main reason so much land in the west is held by the feds is the terrain and lack of water made homesteading 40 or 160 acres difficult or impossible. The homestead act wasn’t repealed until the mid 70s. Much different story than in the Midwest where most land is in private lands because it was possible to carve out a working/profitable farm on typical homesteading acreage.